Thursday, June 22, 2017

What's Up? Topic #23; entries 6/17 ...on

Anything can be posted here! We'll talk about politics, some sports (football, basketball, & tennis), Movies, & TV! Posts framed w/ "***" are from other contributors! - (- Comments -)

Current News: Hingis/J Murray win Wimbl. MxD! Fed takes his 8th title & 19th  Major


  1. ***TRUMP'S LIES:

    Many Americans have become accustomed to President Trump’s lies. ...So we have catalogued nearly every outright lie he has told publicly since taking the oath of office.

    Jan. 21 “I wasn't a fan of Iraq. I didn't want to go into Iraq.” (He was for an invasion before he was against it.)

    Jan. 21 “A reporter for Time Mag — and I have been on their cover 14 or 15 X's. I think we have the all-X rec. in the history of Time Mag.” (Trump was on the cover 11 X's & Nixon appeared 55 X's.)

    Jan. 23 “Btw 3 M & 5 M illegal votes caused me to lose the pop. vote.” (There's no evidence of illegal voting.)

    Jan. 25 “Now, the audience was the biggest ever. But this crowd was massive. Look how far back it goes. This crowd was massive.” (Off. aerial photos show Obama's '09 Inaug. was much more heavily attended.)

    Jan. 25 “Take a look @ the Pew reports (which show voter fraud.)” (The report never mentioned voter fraud.)

    Jan. 25 “You had millions of people that now aren't insured anymore.” (The real @ is < than 1 M, according to the Urban Inst.)

    Jan. 25 “So, look, when President Obama was there 2 wks ago making a speech, very nice speech. Two people were shot & killed during his speech. You can't have that.” (There were no gun homicide victims in Chgo that day.)

    Jan. 26 “We've taken in tens of thousands of people. We know nothing about them. They can say they vet them. They didn't vet them. They have no papers. How can you vet somebody when you don't know anything about them and you have no papers? How do you vet them? You can't.” (Vetting lasts up to 2 yrs.)

    Jan. 26 “I cut off hundreds of millions of $$ off one particular plane, hundreds of millions of dollars in a short period of X. It wasn't like I spent, like, wks, hrs, < than hrs, & many, many hundreds of millions of $$. And the plane's going to be better.” (Most of the cuts were already planned.)

    Jan. 28 “The coverage about me in the NY X's & the WAPO has been so false and angry that the X's actually apologized to its dwindling subscribers and readers.” (It never apologized.)

    Jan. 29 “The Cuban-Amers, I got 84% of that vote.” (There is no support for this.)

    Jan. 30 “Only 109 people out of 325,000 were detained & held for ??ing. Big problems @ airports were caused by Delta computer outage” (At least 746 people were detained and processed, and the Delta outage happened 2 days later.)***

  2. ***More Trump LIEs:

    Feb. 3 “Prof. anarchists, thugs & paid protesters are proving the pt of the millions of people who voted to MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!” (No evidence of paid protesters.)

    Feb. 4 “After being forced to apologize for its bad and inaccurate coverage of me after winning the election, the FAKE NEWS NY X's is still lost!” (It never apol.)

    Feb. 5 “We had 109 people out of hundreds of thousands of travelers and all we did was vet those people very, very carefully.” (About 60K people were affected.)

    Feb. 6 “I have already saved more than $700 M when I got involved in the negotiation on the F-35.” (Much of the price drop was projected before Trump took office.)

    Feb. 6 “It's gotten to a pt where it is not = being reported. And in many cases, the very, very dishonest press doesn't want to report it.” (Terrorism has been reported on in detail.)

    Feb. 6 “And the previous admin. allowed it to happen b/c we shouldn't have been in Iraq, but we shouldn't have gotten out the way we got out. It created a vacuum, ISIS was formed.” (ISIS has existed since '04.)

    Feb. 9 Sen. Richard Blumenthal “now misrepresents what Judge Gorsuch told him?” (The Gorsuch comments were later corroborated.)

    Feb. 10 “IDK about it. I haven’t seen it. What report is that?” (Trump knew about Flynn's actions for wks.)

    Feb. 16 “We got 306 b/c people came out and voted like they've never seen before so that's the way it goes. I guess it was the biggest Elec. College win since Ronald Reagan.” (H.W. Bush, Clinton & Obama all won bigger margins in the EC.)

    Feb. 16 “Walmart announced it will create 10,000 jobs in the US just this yr b/c of our various plans and initiatives.” (The jobs are a result of its investment plans announced in Oct.'16.)

    Feb. 16 “When WikiLeaks, which I had nothing to do w/, comes out and happens to give, they’re not giving classified info.” (Not always. They have released classified info in the past.)

    Feb. 16 “We had a very smooth rollout of the travel ban. But we had a bad court. Got a bad decision.” (The rollout was chaotic.)

    Feb. 18 “And there was no way to vet those people. There was no docum. There was no nothing.” (Refugees receive multiple background checks, taking up to 2 yrs.)

    Feb. 18 “You look at what's happening in Germany, you look at what's happening last night in Sweden. Sweden, who would believe this?” (Trump implied there was a terror attack in Sweden, but there was no such attack.)

    Feb. 24 “BTW, you folks are in here — this place is packed, there are lines that go back 6 blocks.” (There was no evidence of long lines.)

    Feb. 24 “ICE came and endorsed me.” (Only its union did.)

    Feb. 24 “Obamacare covers very few people — and remember, deduct from the # all of the people that had great health care that they loved that was taken away from them — it was taken away from them.” (Obamacare increased coverage by a net of about 20 M.)

    Feb. 27 “Since Obamacare went into effect, nearly 1/2 of the insurers are stopped and have stopped from participating in the Obamacare exchanges.” (Many fewer pulled out.)


    Feb. 28 “And now, based on our very strong and frank discussions, they are beginning to do just that.” (NATO countries agreed to meet defense spending requirements in '14.)

    Feb. 28 “The E.P.A.’s regulators were putting people out of jobs by the hundreds of thousands.” (There's no evidence that the Waters of the US rule caused severe job losses.)

    Feb. 28 “We have begun to drain the swamp of gov't corruption by imposing a 5-yr ban on lobbying by Exec. Branch offs.” (They can't lobby their former agency, but can still become lobbyists.)***

  3. More Trump LIEs2:

    Mar. 3 “It's so pathetic that the Dems have still not approved my full Cabinet.” (Paperwork for the last 2 candidates was still not submitted to the Senate.)

    Mar. 4 “Terrible! Just found out that Obama had my ‘wires tapped’ in Trump Tower just before the victory. Nothing found. This is McCarthyism!” (There's no evidence of a wiretap.)

    Mar. 7 “122 vicious prisoners, released by the Obama Admin. from Gitmo, have returned to the battlefield. Just another terrible decision!” (113 of them were released by President W. Bush.)


    Mar. 13 “First of all, it covers very few people.” (About 20 M people gained insur. under Obamacare.)

    Mar. 17 “I was in Tenn. — I was just telling the folks — and half of the state has no insurance company, and the other half is going to lose them.” (There's at least 1 insurer in every Tenn. county.)


    Mar. 22 “NATO, obsolete, b/c it doesn’t cover terrorism. They fixed that.” (It has fought terrorism since the 80s.)

    Mar. 31 “We have a lot of plants going up now in Mich. that were never going t/b there if I — if I didn’t win this election, those plants would never = think about going back. They were gone.” (These investments were already planned.)


    Apr. 11 “I like Steve, but you have to remember he was not involved in my campaign until very late. I had already beaten all the senators and all the govs, and I didn’t know Steve.” (He knew Steve Bannon since 2011.)

    Apr. 12 “You can't do it faster, b/c they're obstructing. They're obstructionists. So I have people — 100s of people that we're trying to get thru. I mean you have — you see the backlog. We can't get them thru.” (At this pt, he had not nominated anyone for 100s of positions.)

    Apr. 12 “The NY X's said the word wiretapped in the headline of the 1st edition. Then they took it out of there fast when they realized.” (There were 2 headlines, but neither were altered.)

    Apr. 12 “Mosul was supposed to last for a wk and now they’ve been fighting it for many months and so many more people died.” (The campaign was expected to take months.)

    Apr. 18 “The fake media goes, ‘Donald Trump changed his stance on China.’ I haven’t changed my stance.” (He did.)

    Apr. 27 “I want to help our miners while the Dems are blocking their healthcare.” (The bill to extend health benefits for certain coal miners was introduced by a Dem & was co-sponsored by mostly Dems.)

    Apr. 28 “The trade deficit w/ Mex. is close to $70 B, = w/ Canada it’s $17 B trade deficit w/ Canada.” (The U.S. had an $8.1 B trade sur+, not deficit, w/ Canada in '16.)

    Apr. 28 “She's running vs someone who's going to raise your taxes to the sky, destroy your health care, and he's for open borders — lots of crime.” (Those are not Jon Ossoff's positions.)

    Apr. 29 “As you know, I've been a big critic of China, and I've been talking about currency manipulation for a long X. But I have to tell you that during the election, #1, they stopped.” (China stopped yrs ago.)

    Apr. 29 “I think our side's been proven very strongly. And everybody's talking about it.” (There's still no evidence Trump's phones were tapped.)***

  4. ***Trump LIEs cont.:

    May 1 “Well, we are protecting pre-existing conditions. And it'll be every good — bit as good on pre-existing conditions as Obamacare.” (The bill weakens protections for people w/ pre-ex. cons.)

    May 4 “We’re the highest-taxed nation in the world.” (We're not.)

    May 4 “Nobody cares about my tax return except for the reporters.” (Polls show most Americans do care.)

    May 8 “But when I did his show, which by the way was very highly rated. It was high — highest rating. The highest rating he’s ever had.” (Colbert's “Late Show” debut had nearly 2 M more viewers.)

    May 8 “Director Clapper reiterated what everybody, including the fake media already knows- there is ‘no evidence’ of collusion w/ Russia and Trump.” (Clapper only said he wasn't aware of an investigation.)

    May 12 “Again, the story that there was collusion between the Russians & Trump campaign was fabricated by Dems as an excuse for losing the election.” (The F.B.I. was investigating before the election.)

    May 26 “Just arrived in Italy for the G7. Trip has been very successful. We made and saved the USA many billions of dollars and millions of jobs.” (He's referencing an arms deal that's not enacted and other apparent deals that weren't announced on the trip.)

    June 1 “China will be allowed to build hundreds of add'l coal plants. So, we can’t build the plants, but they can, according to this agreement. India will be allowed to double its coal production by 2020.” (The agreement doesn’t allow or disallow building coal plants.)

    June 1 “I’ve just returned from a trip overseas where we concluded nearly $350 billion of military and economic development for the United States, creating hundreds of thousands of jobs.” (Trump’s figures are inflated and premature.)

    June 4 “At least 7 dead and 48 wounded in terror attack and Mayor of London says there is ‘no reason to be alarmed!’” (The mayor was specifically talking about the enlarged police presence on the streets.)

    June 5 “The Justice Dept. should have stayed with the original Travel Ban, not the watered down, politically correct version they submitted to S.C.” (Trump signed this version of the travel ban, not the Justice Depart.)

    June 21 “They all say it's 'nonbinding.' Like hell it's nonbinding.” (The Paris climate agreement is nonbinding — and Trump said so in his speech announcing the withdrawal.)

    June 21 “Right now, we are one of the highest-taxed nations in the world.” (We're not.)

    - -

    Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 14h

    MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN! - (Only in his diluted mind.)***

    The standards have fallen so far for electing someone, I can see a serial killer getting a future nomination! Reps would say, "at least he stands for something!" Trump alone has lowered the bar so far, Charles Manson might toss his hat into the ring in 2020! Heaven knows the competence is comparable; maybe a bit higher w/ Manson!

  5. Big surprise, Reps putting off vote on HC today! Senators are going to the WH this afternoon to waste more X w/ Trump knowing this is going nowhere! McConnell's standing up there w/ other Senators repeatedly saying Obamacare is failing! Ok! NOW WHAT? Reps are in complete charge of the WH & all of Congress! The Dems don't = have the power to obstruct as Trump continually keeps saying which is complete BS! They found out a long X ago, it was a lot easier to bitch & say "NO" to everything Obama asked, but now that they're in charge, they don't seem to have a clue and it's pathetic; not them, but the supporters that think nothing of this chaos! If Pelosi & Reed were in charge, all kinds of legis. whb passed by now; the current Congress has done nothing! They have a big ol' "goose egg" in their win column! Remember Trump said we w/b so tired of winning! Winning what; embarrassment & shame?

    ***You're right. The word "winning" has become a byword for "failure." The Trump admin. has done nothing so far of any importance & I don't expect that to change anyX soon.

    All Reps in The House & Senate unanimously campaigned on &/or voted for 'repeal & replace,' so how can they become pro-Obamacare party? It's unimaginable. They all said 'House-Senate-Presidency' means no more Obamacare. They were all unanimous on this issue! Now they'll become pro-Obamacare party?

    This HC battle doesn't seem to have an end in sight let alone a happy ending. I suppose it's too much to hope there w/b an interim policy in place for those who're in dire need while the whole thing is being dragged out. - I think eventually they will repeal Obamacare. Their loyalty is always for the party, not for the people. The reason they are pushing it out is that their constituents may not reelect them in '18 if they pass this bill in its current form.

    8 yrs gone by, & all the GOP cares about is a "Repeal & Replace" trophy bill they can mount on their legis. wall of shame.

    8 yrs gone by, & the GOP comes up w/ House & Senate bills that are < popular than Obamacare, covering far fewer people for >er out-of-pocket costs.

    8 yrs gone by, & mod. GOP senators who can't hide behind Gerrymandered House districts won't touch this bill b/c it's too draconian.

    8 yrs gone by, & far-right GOP senators won't touch this bill b/c it's not draconian enough.

    8 yrs gone by, & it appears the Senate m/b the place where "Repeal & Replace" may finally die.

    We can only hope.

    ...A long way to go & there aren't the votes in the Senate to pass it @ this pt. I doubt Susan Collins will vote for any bill.***

    ...There are so many other hurdles before this thing can possibly hit Trump's "little desk!" '18 is just around the corner & you just can't take away a benefit like this! It was what Reps feared would happen which is why instead of fixing it while in power, they'd rather repeal the whole thing! ...A new Rep. president w/ a Rep. Congress & they can't get ANYTHING done!

    ***Trump's terrible for the working class. - His 1 & only sensible aim was the rapprochement w/ Russia, but he simply lacks the strength of character to carry it out.***

    But they're mainly the knuckleheads that put him in contention to win the Presidency! The same people who cheered his constant refrain of "Obamacare's a disaster & on day 1 of my admin., Reps will repeal it!" Months later, they can't pass anything but a "CR" to keep the gov't running! Hilarious for all concerned IMO! Hillary's kicking back & has t/b amused by the current state of affairs! If she had won, McConnell & Ryan whb given all kinds of cover by just blaming her! NOW what are they going to do? The honeymoon's over & absolutely nothing's gotten done; NOTHING!

  6. ***Hilarious! Reps are saying Dems won't work w/ them hoping to spread the blame.***

    Poor Reps got all they wanted; the presidency, all of Congress, a cons. SC, a majority of the governorships, & most of the State Houses! Now WHAT? Ya got it & now don't know what to do w/ it! Been listening to BS of repeal/replace the ACA for 8 yrs w/ 60+ pieces of legis. to do so & now The Senate's as limp as day old pasta! Those same Gov's toeing the party line up to now are beggin' Trump not to cut the subsidies they get from Obamacare! IDK how they can work w/ Dems after demonizing them for all this X, making it seem like it s/b all or nothing! We're all going to lose w/ this game playing on both sides!

    ***The ACA is failing b/c it was never workable from the beginning as written by the Dems who refused to include or consult Reps. All Reps have to do is leave it alone & watch the results which were predicted before it = became law. ...***

    W/ your kind of winning, you guys might as well stay in bed! You have all this power & can't do a thing w/ it! You have the biggest megaphone in Trump's MOUTH & y'all can't get a damned thing done! You've passed ZERO pieces of meaningful legis.; NO ACA REPEAL, no tax cuts, no infrastructure bills, & watching our dignity & respectability "circle the drain!"

    ***Trump on another Twitter rant vs "MJ!"***

    Trump lowers the office = more going after Mika Brzezinski in a TWEET commenting on her "low IQ" & "bleeding from the face due to a facelift!" This man is so disturbed to waste X w/ this nonsense instead of dealing w/ matters @ hand like HC legis.! Of course the reason he doesn't is b/c he's not able! He wouldn't know WTF he's talking about!

    ***To borrow some words from CNN - "vile" "repulsive." OMG!! He's so immature & ignorant. He can't defend his lies w/o making personal attacks. Flipping back & forth, I haven't = seen anything on MSNBC about this. I wonder if Joe & Mika w/b there tomorrow morning or if they w/b off for a long holiday weekend. ...Does he think any of his wives married him for his looks?***

    = on FNC, the ladies of "Out#'d" were disgusted & let Trump have it! It also makes Melania look hypocritical concerning "cyber-bullying!" Of course Gov. Huckabee toed the line and poo-poo'd it all & meekly said Trump should find other ways to show his displeasure w/ the MSM! His daughter, who's the WH Press Secr. would probably catch HELL if he were any stronger in his condemnation!

    ***I can't stop thinking and feeling sick about the fact that this is the president of the United States. He's like a 12 yo bully or a frat guy or something. Who was stupid enough to vote for this POS; esp. women? Rachel & Lawrence are going to have smoke coming out of their ears tonight, = if they wanted to talk about HC.

    Trump is so embarrassing on a basic human disgust level, but Pence's stances & politics is just as embarrassing & harmful & he'll get away w/ more b/c "moderates" & regular people who don't normally pay attn. to politics wouldn't have that initial disgust instinct that they have w/ Trump. And just t/b petty, but a big part of a reason I think Pence stuck by Trump thru thick & thin is b/c he took a gamble & won. I would hate for him to hit an = >er jackpot.

    He's such an embarrassment to all of us. How can the Reps not do anything to stop him? They just ignore such outbursts when @ least some of them need to tell him to stop acting like a spoiled brat & start acting like a president. Being president of a country is one of the toughest jobs & those who cannot handle the pressure need to step down. W/ Tweets like these it's obvious that Trump has serious mental issues. ...It is our image abroad & our well being internally we're talking about.***

  7. ***Well I'd say Murray has a few things going for him despite his weaker FH & serve. He's one of the best returners the game has ever seen, esp. vs big servers. He's also excellent @ retrieving & has a great BH, both slice & drive. He's a very tactically smart player.***

    Until it doesn't work & he's so run down, he can barely win games! Nole's closed him out @ love or a breadstick sev. X's w/ Andy's tongue draggin' the court! That super-defensive way he likes to play has really cost him; esp. @ the FO last season going 5 grueling sets vs players barely in the top 100! The way he took that 1st set vs Nole, I thought he was in trouble, but eventual Murray cooled off & only showed a lit'l bit of fight breaking Nole the 1st X he served for the match & completing his NOLE-Slam!

    ***No argument from me. You can't just retrieve all day & not get tired. You need an offensive game as well. I'm shocked Lendl hasn't worked w/ him more on taking the initiative & dictating pts w/ winners.

    If Murray was that much >er, he would have won more. Hewitt also had an = H2H w/ Agassi, who was a later bloomer than Sampras & highly ranked up until his retirement. Agassi himself has said (@ the X) that Hewitt was a heck of a player.

    Exactly a yr ago, Djokovic held all 4 major trophies. After being destroyed by Thiem @ the FO, he now has none. ...Djokovic last yr became the 1st man since Laver in '69 to hold all 4 GS titles @ the same X. But he's barely a shadow of the world-beater of '16-17, dropping 7 of 31 matches this season. “I’m not playing @ my best & I’m aware of that. But I’ve got to stay + about myself & my game,” he said. ...“I know that things change: I’m 30, not 20 & I have to adjust to that. Things evolve each yr & you have to adjust & get the best out of yourself.”

    The John McEnroe-Serena Wms Thing - He said that if she was on the men's circuit, she'd be ranked about 700. He was being generous. - I don't understand why you're arguing against the obvious here? Men and women are built differently. This shouldn't be news to a doctor.***

    You guys aren't taking into consideration the ladies' tour uses a lighter/smaller tennis ball to speed up shots; the guys a heavier ball marginally larger! Either w/b a detriment to a woman playing a man! Women trying to hit winners w/ a heavier ball or withstanding the onslaught of a guy using their lighter offering would allow guy to run her to death? It's a ridiculous notion; esp. in today's game! = when the sport moved a lot slower, the consistency of the men would always wear down a woman; SORRY!

    ***Fiero, do you have a link to anything that supports that. I find this suspect. I'm pretty sure they use the same tennis balls.

    Updated: I stand corrected...There are approximately 70,000 tennis balls used each yr @ the USO. use diff. balls than women during their GS tilts.

    According to the USTA, the balls — manufactured by Wilson — are identical in every respect except for the yellow felt coating. “Men & women use the same ball in terms of size, pressure & design,” according to a USTA statement. “The sole diff. is that the men compete w/ an extra-duty felt ball while the women compete using a regular-duty felt ball.”

    But this slight difference can have huge effects on speed & ball action, experts says.

    Doubles specialist Bob Bryan uses both balls regularly at the Open, playing in men’s events and mixed doubles, where the women’s balls are also used.

    “They (the men) would probably hit the serve 175 mph if they were using that (women’s) ball.”

    ...“I guess that’s the answer: They want the women’s game t/b a little bit faster,” he says.***

    I played for well over 30 yrs; there's a difference! If playing on a fast court & I wanted to slow down the action, I used the heavy-felt balls! On clay, when the game can slow down, I used the lighter "regular felt" ball to speed up play!

  8. ***I think Nole should try to win the FO again for a double CGS.***

    Nole still has a real chance w/ other recs like Double CGS & the most Masters! It was a lot easier w/ the ladies; =ly spread over 50 yrs w/ Court, Evert, Navratilova, Graf, Seles, Hingis, S. Wms, & Henin! Each taking their turn being the best of their era; Navratilova far & away the best IMO w/ 167 singles & 177 dubs' titles!

    ***Which is >er, Laver's CYGS or Novak's Fiscal Yr GS? - Laver's '69 GS started on Jan 20 in AO & ended on Sep 9 in USO, over a period of 7+ months & on TWO surfaces (grass & clay). AO '69 had just 54 players & Laver only needed to play 5 matches there.

    Novak's '15-16 GS - He won 28 matches total. To me, Novak's GS is >er, more matches won over longer period of X & on more types of surface.

    ...Novak was way too invested in winning RG & when it finally happened, he just pulled the plug. I think he chd it last yr & probably may have also gone on to win USO for a NCYGS (Novak Cal. Yr GS). The 2 yrs that I thought he could get a CYGS - '12 & '16 - he was relatively underwhelming albeit w/ still very strong results as such. Chd it in '11; think Nadal was sort of feeling hunted by Novak then & MAY have lost to him @ RG but for Lord Fedr spoiling it.

    ...the one thing I want to say is I truly believe that a Cal. Slam isn't any more impressive than the rest. ...CYGS is 1 of a kind & there are 3 NCYGS. But all 4 combos are =ly difficult IMO. All of them require 28 BO5 wins in a row.

    If it's easier now to accomplish, which I think it is, then I don't think it's important if your 4 Slams in a row have the Channel Slam or not. IMO Borg's 3 ChSl's are clearly a more impressive feat than the ones Fedal have accomplished & any new potential one, just like Agassi's CS's more impressive than the other ones that happened after it. Unfortunately for Novak, he didn't win RG a bit earlier in his career. ...

    ITA, Nole winning Eastbourne can only be good for him going forward, but it just shows where his game & confidence is @. There's no way he plays this tourney if he was anywhere near his normal self.***

    He'd have t/b a mental midget not to understand where he is after being unable to defend anything except a minor event in Qatar this season! I'm still SMH on the fall; only taking Canada since completing Nole-Slam! He's made plenty of finals, but hasn't really looked like winning since last spring! I saw a significant drop = before the FO, winning Madrid over Murray taking a last min. invite from Tiriac! We have to keep believing he'll find the right system to get his game somewhere near what it was a yr ago!

    ***The Greatest Female Tennis Player of All X - No doubt S. Wms.***

    A little doubt has t/b expressed w/ another player who has 344 titles in S/D, won 6 majors in a row, owned grass & indoor comps, in the top 10 for 20 yrs, & 7 as #1!

    ***Only the singles slams matter. One can choose to play doubles together w/ singles, & the other can choose to play for 25 yrs instead of 20. Slams are the =izer.***

    W/ the #'s that extreme, we'd have t/b a mental midgets to think all that record c/b ignored! What was ridiculous were the people who instantly determined Nadal was the GOAT b/c he owned Fed! It didn't seem to matter to them that Rafa has only 1 AO, 2 Wimbledons, & 2 USO w/ 10 FO's compared to Fed's 12 wins alone @ the 2 biggies, Wimb/USO! = John McEnroe was on that bandwagon til recently! Navratilova still rules the rec. book, just like Fed regardless of where people want to place her on the ATG list!

  9. ***In which era did Helen Moody play? How many GS singles titles did she win?***

    Not enough to make me care! If people want to discount Court who straddled the am. & Open eras w/ a CYGS & was queen in her day, why would Moody's name come up? Moody was only invoked due to her Wimbledon rec. being surpassed or tied by BJK & Navratilova respectively! One by one, players were regarded "greater;" Evert, Navratilova, Graf, S. Williams! So forgive us who really don't regard Moody as influential; more in line w/ Lenglen who dominated, nary losing a set, much < a match! The >est today loses to a doubles' specialist when going for a CYGS 2 yrs ago! You have to say the level of athleticism's obviously superior to past eras!

    ***Agree w/ Fiero - can't really put Helen Wills Moody above Margaret Court. ...maybe a tad unfair, as there never really was the impact of a split pro/am tour in the women's game like there was in the men's. Court was indisputably the best player of her era.

    Steffi Graf was always the GOAT for me, until Serena won her last major. It's close, but I'd edge toward Serena now.

    1. S. Williams
    2. S. Graf
    3. M. Navratilova
    4. C. Evert
    5. M. Court

    ...I don't think anyone else warrants serious consid.***

    1) Fed - 18 majors, CGS, 300+ wks @ #1, 7 Wimbl. & 5 str. USO's
    2) Nadal - Won 10 FO's, 15 majors & OGCGS (OG in singl. & dubs)
    3) Laver - 2 CYGS (1 am. 1 pro) - should have more majors (11) but for am. rules
    4) Sampras - Held #1 ranking 6 yrs & won 7 Wimbl., 5 USO's, 2 AO's
    5) Djokovic - Won Nole-Slam, 6 AO's, 12 majors, 5 YEC's, more TBD
    6) B. Borg - Won 5 str. Wimbl. & 6 FO's (4 str.)
    7) Agassi - OGCGS includ. 8 majors & OG in singles
    8) Lendl - 8 majors & won 94 titles includ. 3 USO, 3 FO's, & 5 YEC's
    9) Connors - Won 107 titles includ. 5 USO on 3 surfaces, 2 Wimbls., 1 AO
    10) McEnroe - Won 7 majors includ. 3 Str. USO's, 4 overall - 3 Wimbl.
    11) Emerson - Hon. mention winning 12 majors - (pre-Open era)

    ***Obviously talking all-X's problematic, b/c it's impossible to truly compare Wilding to Laver to Nadal. ...Greatness can only ever be relative to what the field is; we can't penalize them either - we can only compare them relative to their own eras.

    ...Chronological order:

    10 Greatest of All Time
    Tony Wilding
    Bill Tilden
    Pancho Gonzales
    Ken Rosewall
    Rod Laver
    B. Borg/J. McEnroe
    Pete Sampras
    Roger Federer
    Rafael Nadal
    Novak Djokovic

    Honorable mentions to Lendl, Connors, Josiah Ritchie, Laurence Doherty, Riggs, & sev. others

    1. Laver
    2. Federer
    3. Rosewall
    4. Nadal
    5. Sampras
    6. Djokovic
    7. Lendl
    8. Borg
    9. McEnroe
    10. Connors

    I'd be happy ranking Lendl, Borg, & Mac in any order, but ahead of Connors & below Novak.

    Agassi w/b next, then a drop to Newcombe, Becker, Edberg, Wilander, Murray, Vilas, Nastase, Ashe, & Courier to round out the top 20.

    If Roger wins 2 more Slams, he passes Laver. They're already a close 1-2, but Laver's overall record & dominance is still >er.

    Nadal may deserve t/b ahead of Rosewall, but his record is marred by inconsistency as it shows up in his relative low wks @ #1. But if he wins another Slam this yr &'s YE #1, I'd push him past Muscles. Novak also has a chance of surpassing Pete & Rosewall, but needs to bounce back in a big way. If I were to + Gonzales to this list, he'd be btw Fed & Rosewall.***

  10. ***Why did the players retire? Did they give a reason?"***

    ......Some like Raonic & Nishikori are constantly WD'ing before they = hit an event, but being in the top 10 don't feel compelled to push it by playing hurt! Lower ranked players will go ahead trying to compete, fully aware they aren't physically or in the self-diag of Tomic aren't mentally "fit!" By showing up & losing in the 1st Rd, they still acquire ATP ranking pts & of course a lot of $$! Fed thought seriously of making a rule to give injured players the pts & $$ so they'll give up their spot in a draw!

    ***Then what does Kyrgios have against the viewers & those people in the stands?***

    Besides being very young, no one likes t/b bothered w/ obnoxious fans! ...I wish I knew why people acted as if Kyrgios is the only 1 out there acting boorishly? Back in my day tennis considered a gentlemen's sport w/ just a handful of real jerks on the tour; Nastase, McEnroe, Connors, & Becker! ...Heaven knows today Nadal has been stealing matches for yrs in so many diff. ways!

    ***The #1 ranked player is still always the best player in the game (at least usually!). We only have computerized rankings from '73 to the present, but there were still consensus #1 players going back ..."TB" have rankings going back to 1877.

    I'm going to use Tennis Base's rankings, which I assembled into a chart for every player that was #1 @ least once. Let's position a pt. sys. like so:

    #11-20 ranking: 1 pt.
    #6-10 ranking: 3 pts
    #3-5 ranking: 5 pts
    #2 ranking: 10 pts
    #1 ranking: 20 pts

    The pt system is arbitrary, but I think is decent for weighing dominance. According to this system, here are some of the 20 greatest players of all X:

    1. 301 Tilden
    2. 202 Laver
    3t. 185 Gonzales
    3t. 185 Rosewall
    5. 165 Federer
    6. 164 Wilding
    7. 150 Ritchie
    8. 137 Sampras
    9t. 131 Doherty
    9t. 131 Connors
    11. 128 Nadal
    12t. 126 Lendl
    12t. 126 Djokor
    14. 117 McEnroe
    17t. 101 Borg

    No system's w/o flaws. A few things emerge:

    1) Look @ how far Tilden's ahead of the field. He's the Babe Ruth of tennis. He was #1 13 X's. Laver had 8, Gonzales & Wilding w/ 7 each, then Doherty, Sampras, & Federer have 5.

    2) Josiah Ritchie? Perfect ex. of a great player who's forgotten b/c he didn't win any Slams. He was still a terrific player who won tons of tourneys.

    3) Interesting how Lendl & Novak are tied right now. Of course Novak isn't done yet & will pass Ivan this yr.

    4) If Rafa finishes #1 or #2 this yr, he passes Sampras.

    5) ...Borg was #1 3 X's, #2 3 X's, #3-5 twice, & #11-20 once. Riggs was #1 3 X's, #2 twice, #3-5 3 X's, #6-10 once, & #11-20 3 X's. So they both were the best player 3 yrs, w/ Borg having a slightly more top-heavy distrib. after.***

    The rankings were a bit of a joke back then in the 70's! Whenever I think of poor G. Vilas, taking 2 majors in '77, winning well over 100 matches, but was still relegated to an "also-ran" when Borg & Connors ruled the day! He was the 3rd or 4th wheel of that era like Lendl in the 80's w/ Borg/McEnroe/Connors & Djokovic now w/ Fedal!

    ***True, Fiero. 'TB' has Connors only #1 twice in the 70s, although once again the 80s. They actually have Jimmy #5 in '75, w/ Ashe #1. Vilas gets '77 & Borg '78, but Jimmy gets it back in '82 when he won 2 Slams. Anyhow, Lendl was easily the best overall player for the 2nd half of the 80s.

    You're also selling Novak short, presumably b/c you're unhappy w/ his results over the last yr. Novak wrestled the crown away from peak Rafa in '11 & was the best overall player--not an "also-ran"--from '11 to mid-'16. Anyhow, 'TB' is close to the ATP rankings, but w/ a few diffs. ...players as #1:

    '75: Ashe
    '77: Vilas
    '78: Borg
    '82: Connors
    '91: Courier
    '98: Rios***

  11. ***...I think you can use slam counts as a big factor in the modern era as the majors are the benchmark, but < so back in the day.***

    Back "in the day," it seemed like the whole season revolved around the summer w/ Wimbledon & The US Open! The FO was really an afterthought, mainly put on a pedestal by So. Am. & Euro clay specialist! The AO wasn't = on the radar, not usual to have 6-8 QF-ists from "down under" back in the 70's! It really was all about the "2 Biggies" & the rest was used for bragging rights, under the table $$, enhancement of endorsements, etc.! The Masters Series being created in '90 along w/ the est. of the new ATP elevated the tourney's just below a major; esp. when the champ had to win BO5 finals! That made it harder than what's happening now w/ the hording of titles by Fedalovic! Before Sampras, no 1 really thought about getting anywhere near the record of Emerson! Laver, then Borg the Open Era royalty! They were the tennis Gawds until Sampras came along! We were so desperate to see history made, we ignored the fact he never = made a FO final! After this latest gen., Sampras has fallen from the apparent GOAT w/ 14 Majors to barely holding his place in the top 6; Borg still given more credit for his short-lived career!

    ***...The Masters Series has made it harder now than it was then for the hording of titles. "Back in the day" everyone played whatever they liked & met each other < frequently. I've always been astonished that the Borg-McEnroe H2H is 7-7. And they're considered a great rivalry.***

    The FO was bouncing around the networks; totally taped delayed until '84 w/ McEnroe/Lendl IIRC! There were also X tours if you remember; ITF, WCT, & the GP Series! - I still seem to remember seeing the last set of Wilander over Vilas in '82 FO on CBS! It went to NBC after that I guess! The women continued t/b delayed until noon here in Chicago so I usually knew who won before it came on! Those '85 & '86 finals killed me allowing Evert back in the winning circle of majors after being owned for yrs by Navratilova in the mid 80's!

    ***I'd rank Borg ahead of Lendl & Connors, = if every single statistical system I've seen ranks him below them. Actually, late last yr. I did an Open Era top 20 blog for "TF," & I had Borg ranked just behind Rafa, Pete & Novak, & just ahead of Lendl, McEnroe, & Connors.***

    = w/ 4 extra FO's, I'd still put Borg ahead of Nadal due to his ability to leave the comfort of his best surface in Paris & w/ no tourney warmup, won 5 str. Wimbledons! Fedal's managed it 3 X's btw them, = w/ the homogenized courts! The imbalance continues in the rankings w/ Nadal woefully behind others @ #1 & no YEC's! He has a chance @ #1 = though dom. by Fed so far this season! In fact, I'd still place Rafa behind Nole w/ 3 < majors, but makes up for it w/ Masters 1000 dominance, being #1 more consistently, & owning X YEC's!

    ***I got some flack for ranking Novak >er than Rafa, so I hear you. ...If he can get to 200+ wks @ #1 & @ least 1 YEC, + another Slam or 2 off clay, I think he's right there in the inner circle w/ Roger (+ Laver & Muscles) in terms of career <ness.

    My initial reaction to the idea that Borg & Lendl c/b put on a similar level was to shudder. But on reflection I guess a case c/b made for it. ...Lendl dominated, he's the prototypical modern player. His game is far more translatable into this era than Borg's w/b I suspect. The man was in more slam finals than probably anyone other than the Big 3, & he wasn't losing to patsies. His 94 titles are phenomenal.***

  12. ***...I still contend that FO was very much a thing in the US, no matter how Fiero remembers it.***

    You have to agree the FO has always been about the "Men's Singles" title! It was esp. prominent back in the 70's b/c of Borg, Vilas, Panatta, & Nastase! Only 2 US R-ups in Gottfried & Solomon! You had Evert winning a couple titles on the ladies' side before skipping a yr or 2 to play WTT w/ the other stars of the day; BJK leading the way w/ Goolagong, Navratilova, Wade! It started being won by players barely in the top 10 & how highly regarded can you take an event; sorta like those lean yrs "down under?" ...The following season w/ 5 set classic of Lendl/McEnroe being played live made it golden!

    ***On what basis are you giving Lendl the edge on stats?

    Borg obviously has the edge in Slams, 11 to 8 - also win % (but that's largely due to retiring early). But in almost every other way, Lendl's resume is superior. Consider:

    *94 to 64 titles, or +30 titles for Lendl
    *35 to 28 big titles, or +7 big titles for Lendl
    *270 to 109 wks @ #1, or +161 wks for Lendl

    It really is a classic case of >er peak (Borg) vs. >er longevity (Lendl), but Lendl's peak was also very high. I also think Lendl played in a harder era; his prime overlapping sev. gens of greats in their prime yrs. Borg had to face a Connors & Vilas on one side, McEnroe/Lendl on the other, but Lendl had to face Connors/Vilas, Borg/McEnroe, but also Wilander/Edberg/Becker & Agassi/Courier/Sampras.

    Again, my pt isn't to say def. that Lendl was >er than Borg, but they're a lot closer than historical memory & surface stats tell us. I go back & forth on it, but my last "official" list written for TF late last yr had Borg ahead of Lendl. But my main pt, again, is that I think they c/b spoken of in the same breath.***

    I felt the same way about Nadal & Djokovic; Rafa w/ a few extra majors, but woefully behind Nole in other statistics including titles, wks @ #1, & ability to defend off "dirt!" As Brit may have commiserated w/ me that Nole's past yr has really hurt the argument, but he still has X to recover; just as he did after '13!

    ***...Is it safe to say the Madrid clay is faster than this? If this is what grass tennis has become, screw this.***

    This is why Borg's a legend & so revered by people in the know of tennis! The man was playing w/ a wood racket that had no real feel since the string tension made it a pane of glass! I experimented w/ it for a season & you're always compensating to give your shots more air due to the ball taking off "fairly dead!" Borg also had to deal w/ grass that was lightning quick, choppy, & gave big servers a distinct advantage! He had to survive many like Tanner, Vijay Armitraj, & Dibley! Then there were the S & V specialist like McEnroe, Nastase, & Gerulaitis to overcome! He wound up owning the most relentless baseliner of his era, Connors in semis & finals! Borg had to defeat these people multiple times in terrible grass conditions, but survived making up his own immortality by winning 5 in a row; playing 6 finals str.!

    ***You made me nostalgic. Some of my earliest tennis memories are Bjorn Borg fan-girling in '77 or so. ...I was someone who liked Pete so it didn't bother me that much, but man, there were a lot of snippy tennis purists who crapped all over the courts being too fast.***

    Borg's 1st "Channel Slam" was in '78 after he skipped FO in '77 to allow his good buddy Vilas to have that bone! He completed the FO/SW19 combo 2 more X's in '79 & '80! It's still a rare feat since most great players seem to have a tough X winning in Paris! Connors & Sampras never played a final, McEnroe, Edberg, and others were always 1 match short! Yeah, the matches c/b boring, but it all depended on the players! Nothing was more entertaining than Gerulaitis & Borg in the '80 semi, going 5 gloriously long sets!

  13. ***... ...It's not really that shocking un< Roger loses the final @ SW19.***

    This is so freakin' sad; as I've been saying for yrs, "the tour's pretty pathetic to allow this to continue yr after yr!" It's amazing that Fed will probably increase what I thought was a set # @ 17 (now 18)! He'll probably take over the #1 ranking soon after & has no real reason to = think of retiring, though I've begged for it! The "gutless tour" has other emotions bubbling w/i me! I'm so disappointed by the "next gen" that have arrived in some respects, but when it really counts in the majors, they're all no shows! The vets still rule w/ an avg. age that's well over 30! That's reminiscent of my era when top players weren't run out of the sport so early! It wasn't uncommon to have mostly guys in their 30's w/ the only young bloods @ the top being Connors, Borg, & m/b Vilas! IMD the tour was played by men, not boys! There's been a renaissance it seems w/ vets proving "we're not done!" I congratulate Berdych, Cilic, Queerey, & of course the oldest of them all Federer!

    ***How can you be so disappointed @ the gut< ones when all but 1 of the "Big 4" is out? 1:4 chance of a new Wimbledon champ.***

    If one of these "also-rans" wins & breaks up the party of the "Big 4," then I'll be impressed! ...I'm praying for ANYONE else; Cilic could have the bookends of W/USO to really end his career on a high! Many vets win 1 @ the end like Gomez over Agassi in '90 @ 30 y.o.!

    ***All 3 of the pretenders have decent wins over the "Big 4" @ the business end of a Major, including Berdych & Cilic over Fed. There's still a chance. This is what you've been asking for.***

    So I'm just imagining all these yrs of 4 guys owning the tour w/ few & far btw wins outside that group? Del Po, Cilic, & Wawrinka the only players who seem to have = broken thru @ least once! Stan has more ability than 2 of the Big 4, but his brain isn't ready for the strain of consistent excellence! He can blow Nole off the court in Paris in the middle of the >est run since Laver in '69, but lose in the 1st Rd to some "LL" in a 250! You just can't do that! Berdych might get that 1 upset of Roger @ Wimbl. or Rafa "down under" a few yrs ago, but along w/ Ferrer, he's been the biggest waste of talent! ...Let's just say I won't be surprised Roger goes ahead & finishes up this '06-Redux!

    ***I think you hugely underest. the talent diff. btw the B3 @ least & the field. And Murray's a huge talent. Stan has a high ceiling & a big bttm; IMWTO. The sad loss to the comp. is Del Po to injury. Berdych & Ferrer have actually maximized their talents, IMO. Their games are solid, but uninspiring & their weapons have flaws. Same w/ Cilic, who's more like Stan, vis-a-vis "ceiling." They haven't failed to capitalize b/c they're spine<, but b/c they're <er-lights. ...If they could have, they would have. But the vast majority of them have been pushing a large boulder up an unconquerable hill. Once in a while someone else forces their way thru that window of op., but the B4 have kept it pretty narrow or firmly shut. The window is cracked now, but Fed's still waiting to slam it on someone's knuckles.***

  14. ***Sampras>Borg - so while I see Borg in the poll options, @ least Sampras s/b included. Sampras is clearly surpassed by Fed & Borg's mostly a ?? of "could have, should have afterwards" so IMO either/both are in the poll, or neither.

    Agree that Sampras belongs on the list. The man who won comfortably the most in the era of the quickest tennis there has ever been deserves an incredible amount of credit, but Borg's not a case of would've should've! He dominated Wimbl. like Fed did & RG like Nadal did, & did it @ the same X. He did it at a X when they required completely diff. skill sets. ...4 finals there is magical enough considering his other accomplishments. Throw in the 2 Masters victories when that tourn. was hot shit & played on the ever fast carpet. Borg's abilities to dominate the fast & the slow are w/o = in the entire history of the game. No Rosewall & Laver, no Becker/Lendl, no Fedal; just Borg.

    The best all around tennis players I witnessed play @ their peaks were Fed, Nadal, & Borg. They could dom. on certain surfaces like no other & were always in the mix in their least fave (Fed - clay, Nadal - Grass, Borg - HC's). Then you can throw in a mix of Sampras, Djokovic, & Agassi & that w/b my "Greatest" list of modern era players.

    Samoras never seemed to dom. matches & it wasn't always clear he was the best player on the court someX's, but he'd still end up winning. - Right now I'd vote for Fed as GOAT, & I'm not sure it's a close debate.

    Yes, ridiculous to exclude Sampras from any Goat list. 14 slams, 7-0 in Wimbledon finals. IMO, peak Sampras vs. peak Fed on any Slam surface other than clay, including current Wimbl. grass; Sampras wins the majority. His serve would carry him thru those TB'. - Amongst the male players, Djokovic, Laver, & Budge are specially mentioned & separated from the others for their achievement of holding all 4 major titles @ the same X in roll of honour. Along w/ a few female players such as Navratilova, Graf, Wms, Connolly, Court.
    --- still doesn't mean that Fed wasn't close to holding all 4 Slams simul.. And it doesn't mean that Nole's >er than Fed either; 19>12.

    ...Oh, Nole's subsequent op c/b vs Berdych - never mind.***

    How many X's does a shocker happen though? Nole owns a few players like Del Po, Berdych, Cilic, & Ferrer, then all of a sudden they step up & bite him in an important moment! Djoker has a clear advantage over Murray & Wawrinka, but they've thwarted him in major finals about as much as any top player! That's why I set them above players of past eras since the draws are so tough; the seedings protecting the top echelon to #32 in majors! In my day #17 could play #9 in the 1st Rd of the USO! McEnroe was taken out by Annacone in '86! The Masters' Finals going to BO3 also helps their winning ways today! Fedalovicray have so benefitted from these protections & are running away w/ the recordbks! I just can't see anyone in the near future able to muster the kind of excel. needed to overcome THEse GOAT's!

    ***Cilic looked overwhelmed by the occasion. ...Obviously, Nadal & Djokovic are more complete than Cilic, but so is Fed, & that's why he has 19, Nadal 15, & Djokovic 12 slams. They have won a lot b/c they all have the ability to adapt.***

    ...That's nothing new when it comes to Wimbledon; the "pomp & circum." makes it easy t/b overwhelmed to win in an upset! Esp. in this era, one of the "Big 4" will continue to own the tour & no 1 s/b surprised that Cilic wasn't up to the challenge! ...Cilic has all the ability in the world & I knew it wasn't worth waking up early to see! That 6-1 2nd set tells you all you need to know! It doesn't take a psychic to see where this is going as "ATP TOUR of '06" Redux continues!

  15. ...I laugh when Trump & his peeps accuse others of being dishonest! They should look in the mirror and look deeper into their own wretched souls; if they have any!

    ***Give a specific example of an illegal act he has committed that c/b verified while president.***

    That "act" having to do with "profiting" while president; doubling fees @ his golf courses, sending people to his hotel down the street from the WH, & plenty of other ways improperly ingratiated by people currying favor! ...we see Trump selling off the majesty of the POTUS! The Trump boys already bragged about how much Chinese & Russian $$ flows thru them! ...After Trump, where should we go the next X; a reformed serial killer?

    ***Unfortunately getting "dirt" on one's opp. is just the nature of the beast known as politics. - Unfortunately getting it from foreign, hostile entities is a little diff. & then of course lying your ass off about it is = worse.***

    The smoking gun is the evidence of these political hacks in the WH beng caught LYING about = meeting Russians! What about that?

    ***...Say it again; "What Trump / Russian scandal?"***

    It's infuriating to see the sycophants of Trump who refuse to = relent to anything being wrong! Not sure Jared & Don Jr. know what it means to LIE on an Int'l scale! ...These BOYS are in trouble & I'm not sure Trump can get away w/ just pardoning indiscriminately after all the kvethin' in the past from Reps over Clinton's back in 2000 before he left office!

    ***Imagine if Hillary was president & Chelsea did exactly what Butthead Jr did. Think of what Hannity & the Trump whores w/b screaming?***

    ...Since the election I've said to myself & friends, "Hillary dodged a fk'n bullet!" If the country was spiraling out of worldwide favor like this under her leadership, Rep's hair w/b on fire! ...The sticks & torches are out for these impotent pieces of SHIT in Congress who asked t/b given total control for yrs, undermining Obamacare w/ repeal legis. 60+ X's, & talked down the economy!

    Trump still says he "inherited a mess!" ...They can't seem to stay on message, constantly stepping on their own + news cycle, turning it into comedic fodder! Reps own it from coast to coast, all of Congress, & now the presidency & they can't get a single thing done!

    It's gotten so bad they brag about a "stolen" SC appt & reversing all of Obama's EO's! Too bad I'll be long gone before it's written what a joke this admin. turned into! It w/b funny if it weren't so tragic!

    ***Are people really this excited about the prospect of President Pence?***

    I know I'm not! Status QUO w/b cool for the next 3+ yrs w/ this feckless president & Congress! What a joke these people are after begging the American people to give them the power to do their will & NOT one piece of legis. has been passed in 6 months! We will actually get a chance to see a party "shut the gov't down" on their own! It's bad enough when blamed when not in power, but for this to occur b/c they might not be able to raise the "debt ceiling" in a X-ly fashion & pass a budget this fall! They're incompetent hacks who've shown they do >er as "the oppo" just to say NO to everything! Actual governing is hard work & these a-holes just aren't up to the task! If Pelosi was in charge, 50 Bills whb passed by now! She's famous for passing 200+ pieces in a single Congress while Ryan's sitting there w/ his thumb up his ass unable to control his caucus! "Well people; this is what you wanted! I hope you enjoy it!"

  16. ***Anyone who thinks McConnell & Ryan are going to stop w/ gutting Medicaid had better pay attn. Soc. Sec. & Medicare are next.***

    A smarter group of people would try to fix The ACA instead of undermining & hoping it fails! Now that it's part of the Nat'l entitlement consciousness, Reps are stuck & they still don't know what to do! They're screwed either way; repeal the ACA & most of the country will club them to death! Their base won't be satisfied w/ anything short of complete repeal due to the constant haranguing by them making it seem like something good taking away an entitlement! ...Now they're going back on their promise allowing Obama's tax hikes to pay for it!

    ***WH budget "tanks" - The CBO said Thurs. that Trump’s 1st budget plan would not elim. the deficit over 10 yrs or expand the economy @ all by '21, ...

    ...The WH asserted the gov't would have a budget sur+ in '27 if its policies were enacted, bringing in more $$ thru rev. than it spent. That's a gap of more than $700 B in just 1 yr btw the CBO & WH. ...***

    ...Trump's a FK'n lie! He does it so much, it's excused by his stooges! They're propping him up when he shb exposed as a nut yrs ago! I blame his family above all, but they wanted power! Now that they have it, they had >er run! The LAW w/b on them soon for all kinds of impropriety! Jared might end up in the same cell as his father held 10 yrs ago!

    ***This is a truly bad idea:

    In a closed-door GOP conference meeting Fri. morning, House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy said all 12 appropr's bills w/b finished in comm. by the end of next wk. Starting Mon., leadership will begin a tent. whip ct on whether lawmakers would vote for a package before the Aug. recess that combines all of those bills into one $1 T gov't funding bill. ...

    ...And it get’s = worse:

    Perhaps more worrisome: The bill might fail on the floor, which would provoke another flood of damaging headlines about the GOP’s deep divisions & inability to govern…

    …That’s why GOP leaders want the conf. to commit to passing the final bill — whatever it looks like — before they move down this path. McCarthy asked members to read the various spending bills over the weekend & be ready to give leadership feedback next wk.

    ...They want their members to spend the weekend reading 12 massive appropriations bills & then commit to a vote on all of them regardless of what m/b introduced during the amendment process.

    ...They’ll be asked to give up all their leverage on the front-end, basically ensuring that they have no say. And all for a bill that may not = pass the House let alone become the law.

    Even mod. leader Dent of Penns. is acting like he’s not getting enough O2 to his brain:

    ...He knows that this is all theater but he’s signing up for it anyway = though he knows that in the end the cons won’t be there to vote for their own spending bills. And when that happens, Ryan has to rip it all up & go crawling to Pelosi to avoid a gov't shutdown.

    In the end, all that is accomp. is a demonstration of ineptitude & lack of unity combined w/ dozens of damaging roll call votes. This is what passes for strategy w/ the Reps as they do everything they can think to delay the moment when they have to ask the Dems to help them govern.

    - - ***

  17. Donald Trump Jr. releases email chain on his Russian meeting

    - -

    ...Why can't the people who attended that meeting or were involved in arranging it agree to meet & answer all ??'s so this issue c/b resolved & gov't can get back to work?***

    Trump's like any other pol; "never admit to anything = if it c/b proved!" This is why there's been this "drip, drip, drip" when it comes to this drama w/ the Russians! All concerned think they can weather the storm by undermining the MSM, making excuses by surrogates, deflecting by invoking Hillary's emails, & in gen. acting like Putin; "I'm right & everyone else is wrong!" Trump got away w/ those bullying tactics back in NY, but this is The BIG X & the Int'l media isn't going to let him get away w/ this! I think he's maxed out the stupidity of his followers & they should start ??ing his behavior & his campaign!

    Most people w/ $$ tend t/b cons. Reps living the life out in the suburbs! It's sorta duplicitous that many of these women of the franchise who seem so liberal like LVP probably vote "R!" My own college roommate kept that to himself for 27 yrs! He's a Mensa member, spoke fluent German way back when, took Russian as a freshman, seems liberal, & BTW is gay, but like most cons. Reps votes vs his own interest! Did he live thru that Jihad vs gay marriage back in '04? The last 10 years have been a strain since the lines of demarcation are deep in this country! This isn't just about a diff. of op.; character & morality come into play w/ both sides smearing the other!

    ***It's fascinating to hear explanations from trumpanzees- voting against their own self-interest, voting to have people they love brutalized, = killed. ...They're obsessed by all things superficial, & t/b fair, they probably have no idea they voted for a charlatan - they simply want t/b on the side of "the wealthy." Many aren't wealthy enough to benefit from gigantic tax breaks in the trumpkill bill, i.e.; they just don't know it yet.

    So what, it's rigged? Of course Reps wanted Cruz or Rubio or Jeb or Kasich over Trump.***

    It's only cheating if Dems do something wrong! The double standards are piling up w/ these people! IDK how they can keep it all str.? Trump's acceptability has lowered the bar so much, what's next "a reformed serial killer?" After what's been excused w/ nauseating deflections to Hillary, I'm glad I won't be around to see the next incarnations of Reps & who they support!

    ***White House kicks off 'Made in America' week***

    What a bunch of idiots! Supporting some asshole who's hoodwinked them w/ "America First" slogan, but @ the same X well knowing the only thing Trump's produced in this country is the BS that comes out of his mouth! His furniture, suits, ties, & everything else is cheaply made somewhere in Mexico, Istanbul, China, & other far away places so he c/b this obvious hypocrite that's getting away w/ murder!

    ***IDK why things were held up, but I find it despicable that the recruits' skills are used to keep the US safe & now they're facing the threat of deportation.***

    That's the American way going back to the beginning! The Pilgrims would have expired that 1st winter back in the 17th century if not for the Native American Indians! Their reward was systematic genocide still going on! Then there were the Asian & Mexican Americans who helped build the train tracks across the country, but wasn't accepted & thought of as being "different!" Do we really have to reminded of Japanese Interment Camps; slavery? Why are we surprised our country selected a nut to run things who's doing exactly what they want done? We need to stop being so shocked at ANYTHING that happens these days!

  18. Trump continues to put himself in this pos. of being a liar!

    ***...Were you this concerned when Obama kept blaming Bush thru his admin.?***

    Well if you consider "W" leaving office after starting/leaving 2 wars, an economy in collapse, the stock market cratering, unemployment soaring, & the auto industry about to go under costing = more job, I think it was justified in Obama mentioning the previous occupant of WH! Trump & the country was fortunate that Obama left the country in great shape = though he says "I inherited a mess!" Hmmm, I think most would love to inherit a thriving economy on a mild trajectory that is still going up 1% or so a yr, a record DOW, low unemployment, & believe it or not a "health care" system in place, but waiting for a few fixes! If not for Reps beating the law w/ a club, it w/b working fine, but the relentless haranguing of the ACA makes all concerned nervous, esp. insurance providers! That's why rates are going up exponentially; constantly being undermined by small minded & empty headed cons!

    ***I'd like to beat Bernie w/ a pole, if you know what I mean.***

    Yeah, Bernie & that other woman running hurt Clinton; Sanders early during the primaries & Stein on election night! We're talking mere 1000's of votes being the diff.! I still say as much as she could have saved us from this troglodyte, Hillary dodged a bullet! Congress would still be as dysfunctional, but they would have had her to legitimately beat on & blame! The people in the country aren't very bright; broad daylight news & we still do stupid shit! Look who we have running the whole show; Reps from coast to coast! They have the power to do anything & @ this X are paralyzed due to their leader being under siege! Nothing's going to change anyX soon & they're destined t/b on pace to not pass a legitimately large piece of legis. in the 1st year of this term! They own it! "Do nothing Congress" will take on a whole new meaning & definition after this! Trump outside of being possibly Impeached, will end up being only a placeholder on the list of Presidents! "Thanks so much Donald!" Poetic justice has Jane Sanders under scrutiny for some shady loan dealings involving a defunct school she was running!

    The MSM is reporting Trump & his people are looking into possibility of him pardoning his kids & himself! What a mess! At the same X they're looking into trying to discredit Mueller! They need to look in the mirror someX before they die! What a collection of reprobates!

    ***He's looking for a way to fire Mueller to protect himself. He may fire Sessions so he can appoint a new AG who'll fire Mueller. This pardon business is a 'just in case' thing. I am afraid he's going to use his presidential powers to protect himself. It seems a POTUS cannot be indicted. I hope he will long enough t/b indicted b/c some day he will not be POTUS- either in '21 or '25.

    ...The most important diff. btw the parties on HC m/b that the Dems had a vision that they were thoroughly committed to & were astonishingly courageous in effecting. No one had more to lose from sticking w/ the forced march toward passage of Obamacare than Nancy Pelosi, & yet no one was as devoted to the cause. If she becomes speaker again in '19 after Reps—disunited, selfish & fearful—have whiffed on repealing her handiwork, it w/b the sweetest revenge.***

    The Big LIE undermining the ACA is from the "right" saying it was "rammed" thru Congress w/ lit'l debate & no contributions from Reps! ALL lies; Obama went on an extensive speaking tour, gave countless press conferences, hosted town halls, & Republicans got all kinds of input/amendments = though none voted for the bill! The only reason the ACA is on life support is b/c Reps are choking off the oxygen hose! It's an entitlement they wanted to eliminate & it's "too late baby!"

  19. ***...If Fed gets to 20 w/ the USO or someX next yr, I think I'd write off = Rafa's chances of overtaking him.

    The McEnroe bros said they had heard Nole was not playing the US HC swing. - ...Since when was the USO Nole's fave slam? Surely his 6 @ AO trumps his 2 USO's.***

    Well The USO does have more of his fantastic wins & horrific losses, but making the SF's again & again unlike the other "Big 4!" Who can forget him saving X MP's vs Fed in cons. USO SF's? Nole really has been the most consistent over the last 10 yrs & remained in the top 3 all this X making major final after final!

    ***...After the beautiful yr in '12, '13 turned out t/b a disaster & Fed suffered more & more painful losses in '14 W, '15 W, '15 USO's. ...

    ...Federer was widely considered the greatest player ever to play the game from '09 Wimbl. when he broke the slam rec. @ the X, but this status doesn't hold on forever if he stayed still & others moved up. Nadal & Djokovic always there to push him. His GOATness was challenged sev. X by those ATGs, but every X they came closer, Fed has reached new heights of his career to make sure he's on the top & they're far distant. We should thank Nadal b/c w/o him it's hard for Fed to keep his motivation for that long. Once the golden era's finally gone, the next great gen. will frustrate to know how high the mountain they have to climb.

    Agassi was a more dangerous returner vs big servers, but gave away many pts due to his game's high risk nature, while Djokovic is more consistent.***

    If Chang was the returner GOAT, the prognosticators are going to go w/ the more glamorous Agassi! It's sorta like the masses outside of the game thought Agassi was "the man" & not giving any credit to Sampras b/c no milti-M $$ campaign making him a household name w/o winning a anything! It took Agassi almost 10 yrs to earn the credit he'd been getting since his "crib days!"

    ***Chang had >er stats majority of X. ...6/10 yrs had >er stats for him. Yet USA bias says Aggasi GOAT!

    1. I agree w/ your pt about many tourneys being on grass & thus Laver's CYGS was easier those days.

    2. However, I disagree ...Laver was successful in the pro circuit & was also successful when pros were allowed to play in regular slams.***

    Like any era, you can only play vs the comp. & conditions offered & available @ the X! It's a bit ridiculous to try & fault Laver for either pros being barred from major events until the end of '68 or the fact 3 of the 4 majors were played on grass! That's about as ridiculous to blame the current "Big 4" for the overuse of homogenized courts & being protected w/ 32 seeds! ...IMO Rafa's the weakest of the 4 w/ so many issues over the yrs w/ his consistency! Roger the only player so far who's maxed out his abilities!

    ***I'm no Rafa-fan, but Rafa the weakest of the Top 4?? Seriously? Andy Murray anyone?

    Speaking of the overall X spent on & off the court guy! No top player I know has been as absent from the tour! To this day Rafa's been unable to defend a title off the clay surface! ...He barely competes w/ Borg in being #1 who played 1/2 as long & didn't go "down under" but maybe once! Murray's done the best he could seeing as Fedalovic just happened t/b standing in his way since the beginning! He's truly been the "Vitas Gerulaitis" of this era in most people's opinion, but playing that def. game, he maxed it out & has a few majors for his troubles! He's done more than most w/ the kinds of obstacles in his way! Lendl, like Djokovic was the perennial #3 behind Borg/McEnroe & McEnroe/Connors = though he accomplished about the same if not >! Ivan still got 2 Wimbledons & a USO out of the guy!

  20. ***...At the least, I do include Moody in the "herd of GOATesses" - along w/ Court, Evert, Navritilova, Graf, & Serena. To me those 6 are clearly above everyone else. We can quibble in what order they s/b placed, but I don't think there's a good argument that they aren't the 6 greatest female tennis players of all X. W/ the men, the list is slightly < distinct & maybe a bit larger, but there are still about 10-12 players who are GOAT candidates, w/ everyone else in the next tier out. And = though I think there's a valid argument that an Andy Murray is now a >er player than was, i.e., a Bill Tilden, I don't think we can say that Andy is a >er player than Tilden, historically speaking.***

    I can't tell you how many X's I've had to revisit this topic, from Laver being the consumate and consensus GOAT w/ his 2 CYGS; 1 as an Am. in '62 & another as a pro in '69 to Federer's rebirth winning #18 & #19! Borg came along performing like no other in pro history taking 5 str. Wimbledons & 6 of 8 FO's w/ rationalizing going on to change who was thought of as "the best!" It was settled until Sampras came along breaking the men's records! We were so set on making history & proclaiming him the GOAT, we overlooked he hadn't = played a FO final! After this latest crop of greats, Fedalovic have pushed Pete below Laver & Borg = though he has 14 majors! At least Borg played in 4 USO finals; the 1 slam he was never able to snag! I give more credit to Borg due to such a short window accomp. so much! Roger's the man = though 2 players have owned him for the most part over the yrs in major events! He has turned the clock back & taken over rivalry w/ Nadal, but's still woefully behind in the H2H! OTTH, this is how I remember it:

    '70's - Laver led the way over Borg = though Emerson held a rec. 12 majors to Laver's 11!

    '80's - Laver still owned it over Borg w/ Lendl coming up fast w/ a ton of accomps,!

    '90's - Laver still revered, but Sampras started coming on strong taking 7 Wimbl. & 5 USO's

    '00's - Sampras owned it, but Fed has a stretch in the mid decade like no other winning 3 of 4 majors 3 X's! He becomes the definitive GOAT w/ Nadal closely behind!

    '10's - Fed extends his lead over the rest of the field in the history of the game, w/ the only comp/ left is to see who's #2! Right now it's btw 3 players, Nadal, Djokovic, & Sampras!

    ***...I would go w/ Navratilova as the GOAT. # of slams not just in singles, dominance, a partner in the >est rivalry tennis has seen. I mean... think about it, had Evert not been there she would probably have 30 singles titles & we wouldn't = be debating this!***

    I always thought she lost some of those single's finals due to overplaying; singles, dubs, & MxD when possible! She was too successful @ all of them so it wasn't usual for her to play 2 or 3 X's a day; esp. closing in on the finals! Funny, I still remember having to wait until the recordbk in '86 to find out if she won the Inaugural MxD event @ The Lipton Int'l of '85! That was the 1st X I remember her winning all 3 events in Delray Beach! It was considered the 5th major @ the X!

    ***That's a fair pt!***

    I don't think people remember or realize how dominate Navratilova was @ the X from '82-86! In '83 it was about winning games vs her, least of all sets! I overslept a lit'l & missed the 1st set of her defeat of Jaeger @ '83 Wimbl.! It was over in 13 min. w/o a loss of a game! That would be about the X for 2 games w/ Azarenka & Sharapova!

    ***Yes I agree. That's why I think she's hand down the GOAT; if I'm going to call anyone the GOAT that is. I find comparing across sexes no more absurd than across distant eras.***